We’ve all been there: I was standing at the Lancôme counter at Saks Fifth Avenue and asking for a sniff of a new fragrance, in this case Lancôme Peut-Être. The sales associate said, “Ah, yes, it’s so beautiful!” She sprayed it on my arm, and a few seconds later I lifted it to my nose. “What do you think?” she said eagerly. “Isn’t it beautiful?”
The fragrance was barely dry, and I wasn’t ready to say anything about it, really. But the ambery mix I smelled wasn’t what I’d expected at all, given the ad campaign touting French gardens full of roses and jasmine. “I thought it would be more floral,” I said.
“Oh, floral. Try this — Mille et Une Roses. Very beautiful,” she said. I had the feeling that she could be dabbing other liquids on my arm and saying, “Lysol toilet cleaner. Beautiful. You should treat yourself,” while she calculated her commission. I wrassled a few drops from the tester to try later, but my first impression was that it smelled like Lorenzo Villoresi Alamut lite.
Peut-Être is the latest of Lancôme’s La Collection of reissued fragrances, including Sikkim, Magie, Mille et Une Roses, Climat, Sagamore and Cuir (Cuir is only available in Europe). Lancôme originally released Peut-Être in 1937 and credited it to Armand Petitjean. According to Basenotes, Peut-Être (which means “maybe” in French), was renamed Qui Sait, (“who knows”) in 1956 before being discontinued. The original Peut-Être featured rose, lily, and linden.
Nathalie Lorson, the nose behind the very different Lalique Encre Noir, retooled Peut-Être for release this year. She retained the original’s rose and linden and added lilac and a robust amber and musk base. Lancôme’s public relations created a story around Peut-Être starring a love-struck woman in her garden mooning away about her man. While she’s there, with rose and jasmine wafting by, presto! here comes said man with something in his hand that we are led to conclude is an engagement ring (and not socks needing mending or a pair of tickets to a monster truck rally, for example).
From this story, I imagined Peut-Être would be a warm floral with an earthy base. Instead, on my skin Peut-Être is an amber and musk powerhouse just barely tempered by rose, lilac, and sweet linden. It isn’t as light and tingly as the linden-musk combo of L’Artisan L’Eté en Douce, nor is it the powder, amber, and sandalwood whammy of Villoresi Alamut, but it’s something in between. As Peut-Être wears on, it becomes simpler and sweeter.
Once Peut-Être’s alcoholic top burns off it almost feels like something you’d make at the local bath shop from essential oils. In fact, after I wore it a few times I drove down to a drugstore to try Jovan White Musk, having a hunch that the $9.99 30 ml bottle of White Musk Cologne spray might trump the $125, 50 ml bottle of Lancôme Peut-Être Eau de Parfum. The Peut-Être kept its edge of quality over White Musk, but the fact that I thought to compare them at all pretty much sums up how I feel about Peut-Être: nice, pretty, but ultimately boring.
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Nice review, Angela. Sorry to hear it was such a boring scent, but thanks for indirectly tipping me off about Sikkim & Climat, both of which it sounds like I may need to try.
Pretty and boring? That about sums up my feelings for the entire La Collection.
Am wearing Tropiques now, from Colection Voyages, a fruity floral, and subject to a few sneers from some of the more discerning noses in this forum. Not by signature fragrance, but nice, summery, good for the office, and more interesting than Climat, the only fragrance from La Colection that worked remotely with my chemistry.
Phew! Now I've done it and you can label me a FFF (Fruity Floral Fan – which I am NOT by the way) but I don't care.
Yves de Saint Laurent said one should know the difference between elegance and snobbery. Tropiques is not elegant, but La Collection IS, to me, a snobbery. Apart from one of my dear departed grandmothers (the other one was a Nina Ricci fan) I can't imagine anyone under 80 wearing La Collection.
I liked Climat and Sikkim both better than Peut Etre. The word on the street is that Lancome will be dropping Sikkim soon, so if you like it now's the time to stock up.
Relieved to see that someone else was underwhelmed by Peut-etre. The SA sprayed it on a card for me, but when I sniffed I couldn't smell much of anything. I wondered if he'd missed the card completely! Later, I was able to pick up something lightly floral and musky, but nothing that belonged to that man/moon/garden ad copy. Dull.
It's very timely that you put a YSL quote into your comment, and a great quote, at that.
Don't feel you have to apologize for liking the occasional fruity floral! For some reason cassis and berries smell so good to me in the dead of winter–maybe it's because the cold air tempers them. Anyway, I like a little fruit from time to time, too.
“According to Basenotes, Peut-Être (which means “maybe” in French), was renamed Qui Sait, (“who knows”) in 1956 before being discontinued.”
In its next incarnation, it will be called “Whatever” (however that translates into French.
I keep thinking that there's a bargain musk and amber combo out there that could easily substitute for Peut Etre. I'm sure PE is a high quality musk and amber, but it's sort of like having a high quality, plain white salad bowl. Why pay $125 when you can get the same experience for so much less?
Thank you for the suggestion of Tropiques. Of the La Collection scents, the description of Climat is the one that most appeals to me, so I will have to seek out Tropiques if you say it is even more interesting.
I agree with you completely about the price of snobbery and it kills me when a lovely scent get s a hideous bottle. Marc Buxton has done some very nice work for Givenchy , creating (gasp) fruity florals with unusual complexity that are packaged in My Little Pony pink bottles for the junior set. Still, lovely is lovely, and a beautiful dry fruity floral is like a Richard Diebenkorn to the chipre's Juan Gris.
And the ad copy will be amended so that the woman in the garden will look up and say to the approaching man, “Oh, it's you again. Get lost. Can't you see I'm reading a magazine?”
By the way, I put a package in the mail to you yesterday. Sorry it's taken so darn long.
Nice comparison!
I've heard that Tropiques has a cranberry note, which sounds interesting to me, but I haven't tried it. I do have a sample of vintage Climat, and it's nice.
Hi Angela: You gave me such a laugh. It's true – what do you do? I feel for SAs, I really do, and so as they enthuse (if that's what you could call it) about the latest monstrosity or even just boring scent, I always try to find a way to smile politely and nod in an unencouraging manner. Occasionally, if I have built up a bit of a relationship with them, I am able to say, “No, thank you. I don't like it.” The worst is when the very nice, determined ones try to expand on the original “beautiful” assessment, even if you have regretfully admitted it is not to your taste. “But don't you smell the gardenia? It's so creamy. Just lovely.”
Gosh! Thanks.
I know the SAs depend on commissions for their income, but I really need time with a perfume to decide whether to buy a bottle. A lipstick? Sure, I can decide pretty quickly on a lipstick. But not on perfume. I wish SAs were paid a living wage so that they didn't have to sell so hard.
That's hysterical. She should be in a housecoat and fuzzy slippers, too.
I'm excited about your package – I'll let you know when it arrives.
Okay, I'll step in to defend Peut-Etre. I love it. On me, it's a lovely aldehydic floral, mostly rose on top, with more iris as it dries down. It's both elegant and soft and comforting at the same time. Something about it reminded me of Tresor, without that perfume's relentless cloud of spun sugar.
Definitely housecoat and fuzzy slippers!
I like Magie Noire, too, although it doesn't last long on me, unfortunately.
Hurray! I'm glad to see a defender. I definitely can understand the soft and comforting part of it.
Peut Etre's aldehydes and iris are almost completely lost on me, unfortunately–my skin must burn them off in microseconds. Tresor is much more rosy on me than Peut Etre, which comes on musk and amber on my skin without Tresor's vetiver or flowers, for the most part. Peut Etre loses its balance on my skin, but it sounds like it keeps it on yours.
I can sympathize with SAs, especially since I sell vintage clothes on weekends, but I think the commission system can in some cases make for an annoying SA. But what can they do when that's how they make their pay? It's a tough system. I do love a great SA, though.
Maybe you'll have better luck with Peut Etre than I did. But if you don't, there are so many fabulous perfumes out there…
Hahahaha! On me it smelled like, essentially, nothing, so glad to hear some vindication. I assumed I was anosmic to some part of the scent.
And I AM sympathetic to SAs — it's a terrible way to sell fragrance, and a terrible way to buy it. But it is the ONLY place where they are so aggressive and act offended if you tell them politely you don't need help. Imagine an SA trailing you through the shoe dept., demanding that you “try this sandal on immediately, it's you! It's fabulous! It's on sale!! No? Well, then, how about THIS one?!?” Then we get the feeling for how absurd the perfume pitch is…
I am grateful that our Saks in San Diego is so much more laid-back than the band of piranhas that seem to man most of their cosmetic counters. I did sniff it and while it was pleasant, it was not FBW for me by a long shot.
rose & linden- drat, now I must try this!
at least they wondered about your opinion after they sprayed something that you wanted them to spray… as opposed to whenever i'm in saks, just sniffing, and someone gets all pushy with the new such and such (it was missoni), and have you tried it yet? you'll love it! then douses my wrist and swoons over how chocolatey it is, and all the while i'm cringing and wishing i could go back to chanel's gardenia or hermes. ha!
March, I wonder if it's the musk that you couldn't smell? I know some people can't smell some musks. And there's a heck of a lot of musk happening in this one.
So true about shoes versus perfume, although I've had plenty of clothing SAs tell me I look good in things I know are hideous on me.
You sum up my thoughts on it exactly.
N, maybe the rose and linden will come out more strongly on you than they did on me (we can hope!).
I've managed to stay out of the way of the spraying ladies for the most part, but sometimes in their ardor it's not very easy!
It's a pity that Perfumed Court doesn't sell samples of that — I went over there immediately to check. Truth is, no matter how nice it is, I'm sure I can manage to live without it.
I too was underwhelmed by Peut-Etre, though it must be said I only smelled on paper. It was an aldehydic, powdery floral, very pleasant but nothing to write home about when N°22 is lurking around the corner. I was with perfumer Vero Kern at the time, who's certainly got a keener nose than mine, but she agreed.
The ad copy for the Lancôme re-edition is unintentionally hilarious. Love the rewrite in the other comments!
“Peu importe” – or maybe even “Je m'en f*” – depending on how far they'd go (cf. ELd'O's names~)
Sorry – this was meant to reply to Existentialist's comment
You're a brave man, Joe. I wish I'd said the same words over many a bottle of perfume!
I once had a French teacher–a French man with questionable English skills–try to explain the difference between je m'en fou and je me'n f***e (hopefully I have those words right). He said, “It is like the difference between these two words:” and he wrote on the chalkboard “sheet” and “shut”. Our brains were spinning on that one, let me tell you.
I used to work in a women's clothing store – no commission, mind – and got far more women coming back to see me, specifically, than the other SAs, because I'd tell people straight if something didn't suit them, and persuade them *against* buying stuff that wasn't right. Strangely, I became the highest-selling SA for that store (a chain) in the Southeast of England – seemingly because I spent lots of my time telling people *not* to buy!
If only more perfume SAs did that, too.
(Gosh, I hope it doesn't sound as if I'm showing off, here: just trying to make a point~)
On me, it's nothing like No. 22–not aldehydic and barely floral or powdery. I'll have to try it on paper, though, and see what it's like there.
Sniffing with Vero Kern! Nice.
Umm… “shit” + “shoot”? But actually, “je m'en fiche” is the lesser of the two, in French… Poor guy!
Whoops! See, I'm the one messing up.
But, yes, you got it.
Your point is well taken! I do the same thing at the vintage store. Unless I see that someone is in love with a dress and nothing I say matters, I'll let the person know if the fit is wonky on her or if she might want to try something in a different color.
Very interesting take, thank you!
Aside from the smell itself, isn't the ad copy about the garden rather *condescending* for today's women? Do they take their ideas out of Jane Austen I wonder? As if validation comes through a marriage proposal to which -as an act of empowerment, in their minds- one might reply “peut- etre”. Or do they mean to imply that the “peut-etre” goes for the proposal itself….? (after all he might be carrying a condom in his hand, the way advertising is done these days!!)
Silly concept.
Or I am in a snarky mood….
And what about “We'll see” or “On verra”…? ;D
Jumping in a little late here
I tried Climat last week and liked it; will have to try again. By far, Magie Noir is my favorite Lancome – although it is EDT, my skin soaks it up and lasts forever on me. I tried to like Mille Et Un Roses (forgive typos) but I just can't bring myself to like a rose scent. My memory of rose perfume as a child has turned me off forever!! lol
And I wanted to join in on the SA chat… I'm an SA and I have had my own experience walking through other stores when I've been captured by vendors and SA's begging me to change my life over their perfume. It's always embarrassing for me, because my instinct is to be polite and smile and nod, while looking for a fast exit with my money kept intact. Some SA's make it so hard to walk away!
For me, with my customers, the first thing I say is “Tell me what you've worn on the past.” I try to show them fragrances that fit in a particular family or don't stray too far. If they like Moon Sparkle, I'm not going to show them Must De Cartier. And I try to never call anything 'gorgeous' – it's not my taste they're looking for. Sometimes I get asked to name my faves – that's always a quandary for me. It also changes, as I fall in and out of love or get bored. But I usually point to Kenzo, Narciso, Annick Goutal, and Guerlain as mainstays.
And finally, I don't care to show a fragrance on a strip. I always tell the customer that it smells very different on skin. Sometimes I take them to our cosmetic sink to wash their hands so they can start with clean skin to sample. And if they are unsure, I give them my card and tell them to come back even if they decide they don't like anything, so we can start fresh. The vendors get irked with me because I can't push according to their goals, only what I think will work for them. And it is ultimately successful, because when they return, they are thanking ME for their purchase.
My only question is: why on earth aren't you cloning yourself? The rest of us poor shoppers would be SO grateful! I tend to only shop in a few places where the SAs know me but on those rare occasions where I venture into, say, Macy's, it's a terrifying experience! And I'm a tough gal! Perhaps their ICBM approach works on the general public – I see people buying stuff – without sniffing, mind you- because of the GWP. Weird.
lol Mamabear. I don't work in Macy's … they way they handle fragrance in Macy's is very different. They depend on Vendors to make the sales (more Vendors than salestaff on any given day) and they know next to nothing about the fragrances they carry. The SA's typically also don't work on commission, and I think that has an effect on how motivated they are to serve the customer. I worked in Macy's once as a Vendor – as in, for one day. I couldn't stand it. I left and promised I would never go back.
I work in a 'better' department store, and on commission. And if I push someone into a perfume they don't like, it will only hurt me when they return it. But I also have tools to help me make sales that won't result in returns- dramming units, decanting supplies, etc. I'm as concerned about returns as the customer is – it hits me in the wallet if they come back unhappy. Oh, and I'm not the only SA that works this way, but we do get hurt by overzealous vendors eager to make their goals. We get more returns from vendor sales than any other kind.
Maybe some day Robin can write an article on the role of vendors and SA's and how to differentiate between them. Vendors are usually the ones with the extravagant vocabulary and the passion for a particular perfume. You can always tell them apart once you start talking to them – they tend to be overly familiar and much more aggressive. Sigh. I make a much better SA than a Vendor, because I suck at being phony.
Not bad!
You're right. There are a hundred happy ends to the garden story that don't have to do with an engagement ring. For instance, say the man who was coming through the garden was a waiter with a tuna melt?
I'm not sure if the peut-etre has to do with her response to the proposal or to whether or not it's actually happening. Either way, I like the story that goes with Cuir better. In that one a chic woman sits in a hotel lobby reading a letter. It has more possibility.
B, you sound like the ideal SA for perfume! I'd definitely go back to you time and again.
M, you're so right. I wonder how many people buy perfume just because of a pretty bottle and GWP?
Interesting! I agree that an article on how the perfume sales industry works would be worth reading.
Id like to join in on the SA conversation: Surely, everyone reading has had some personal experience with a Service industry. On your feet for hours at a time (in heels!) berated daily and given some inane list of behaviors to follow by management who has NEVER been on the floor. And we wont even TALK about secret shoppers who tape you. You, as a customer are in the position to make this a delicious experience! Those SAs cant MAKE you take out your wallet and buy. Dont say the insipid Im just looking. . . why are you here then? Just SAY the truth. No thanks, Im walking through on the way to shoes! I have 137 full bottles of perfume at home, not buying today. I already smell fabulous! Make everyone in the near vicinity LAUGH with you! And when you do find someone on your vibe, BE LOYAL to them and to their store. This is how they make a living, if you want them to continue, wait for them while they are on their day off. It takes a lot of dedication to be there for ankle swelling long hours, weekends and ALL holidays. Nordstroms recently gave their darling SAs New Years Day off. It was IN PLACE OF, their regular day off that week. Of course, they are expected to be aggressive! They dont know what your taste is, Baby Phat? Ugh! You don’t even know what all they can do for you, to make your life more luxurious, if you are just appreciative. And then when the new salesperson wants to envelope you, you can say, thank you, but I only work with Bryce. You want to be left alone? You won’t even see them turn, they’ll be gone so fast. If you read to the end of this rant, thank you for listening. And no, I am not a retail SA, although I did a part time tour 20 years ago, that really opened up my eyes. The saddest thing I can imagine is to get used to luxury. Chaplin, Charlie
1889-1977 British Comic Actor Filmmaker
And then they return the unsniffed product to another store and keep the GWP! But we know who you are…
S, yep, I've done my turn in customer service, too–from hostessing at a barbecue place to hawking vintage clothes, and I know how hard it is. Besides having sore feet, I was just so tired at the end of the day from being “on”.
But I think I'm also what SAs dread at a department store: I want to try everything, but I want to be able to live with a smell for a while before buying. I'm usually not the quick sell, which must be such a drag for the SA. I'll take your advice next time and tell the SA she can leave me be until I need her–as long as the tester I want is on the counter, and the Peut Etre wasn't!
That's terrible! Sometime NST should feature an article by an SA about terrible customers. I bet you guys have some pretty great stories….
Bartamy's work ethic and selling style are so much like mine. I worked in retail for 31 years, over 10 in cosmetics and fragrances. Last weekend, at my 40th High School Reunion, a lawyer friend remembered how I told him NOT to buy something 20 years ago in men's wear. I wonder if he realized that honesty in sales is a valuable asset and not a bad way to help make a choice as to what TO buy.
Tropiques is part of Collection Voyages, you can buy it in airports. There are two more – Benghali and one whose name I can't remember. Benghali is not bad either, unless it's the third one. I tried that a couple of months ago and could not smell a thing.
A great SA doesn't worry about the immediate sale, but about loyalty and client delight. It's not necessary to immediately purchase, but remember such a jewel when you do make a purchase. Some of the finer stores have a comment box right there at the register, whip off a comment or send an email, or letter to that stores customer service. Gratitude is magical, the more expressed the more there is to appreciate! Some stores even give the SA a pat on the head for that.
I would love to smell a perfume with the name “Beat it!” But then that does not fit in the image of Lancome.
StarAngel makes a lot of good points. I guess this thread would be good for another whole article. I am now vendor-paid and haven't changed my selling style in the 5 years I've been doing it. I'm never pushy because it's not the way I like to be treated. Perfume is a delicate and personal thing. My tastes are different from others (obviously) so why push it on them? I'd far rather match someone up with something they love and want than trying to make the sale just to make it. Then they don't bring it back and are more likely to be loyal to me. When I call them for a special or an event, they don't hang up on me because they are thrilled to know I've got what they want and a deal.
It is very difficult standing on a cement floor in heels all day wearing head-to-toe black (how depressing!), handing out blotters, and having nine out of ten people say either they are allergic or wearing something else. This begs the question: Why are you IN the Perfume Dept. then? Luca Turin once joked in his blog that the person in the coffin at a funeral was allergic to perfume and died from wearing L'Heure Bleue. Tsk tsk! Just try the blotter; you don't have to have the fragrance sprayed on your wrist. The one person that may deign to try a blotter doesn't like the fragrance flog of the day. So it's a hard slog er, flog!
Oh yea!
I totally agree – I don't expect to always make an instant sale – some of my best customers are loyal to me because I don't push them into the fragrance du jour but wait for them to grow to like it.
Oh, I wear Born shoes (or Sofft) so I don't have to worry about my feet. And I wear red; I try to stay away from black.
Just don't ask me what I smell like, because it's probably 25 different things that's gotten on me. But my clothes always smell unusual when I get home. 
And jeesh, I could give you stories every day of customers and different experiences… the good, the bad, the ugly, the hostile, the arrogant, the meek, the dirty, the crack heads (crack seems to create an astounding sense of smell for them! lol).
Wish you would tell them to us for this might take away a lot of misunderstandings and prejudices.
.
I second that attitude. I am a nightmare for most SAs. Thanks to you guys, I know all about new fragrances half a year before they arrive in Prague. I know all notes on most good fragrances and who created them and what else he/she created. I know what works on me and what doesn't and would not let myself be intimidated in any way shape or form.
Some SAs turn their noses up and get offended. Others treat me with respect. I even got a job offer as manager of a perfume chain! And one young SA, a gay guy who must have just turned 18 by the look of him, asks me what he should wear everytime he sees me! Well I don't know if he should wear fragrance in a fragrance store, but he should wear deodorant! Definitely.
Regarding the perfect SA, it's difficult to find the one who truly listens and would recommend an old fragrance that suits you over the newest launch. When I find such an SA, I make a point of buying from her, always.
Well that would explain why I haven't tried it. It feels like ages since I've been anywhere.
The SA in Saks said she thought Tropiques was coming to the store, but she hadn't seen it.
Hmm. I'll follow up on it.
A good SA is a definite treasure, I agree.
More input for the article on “The Ups and Downs of Selling Perfume”!
Crack heads!! Yikes!
Well, I definitely see material here.
Maybe the story has possibility, but Cuir smells awful. I wondered whether the tester has gone bad. Mind you, they say one should keep fragrances in a cool dark place, in the refrigerator if possible. And yet, how many times I discovered those bottles are HEATED from the display lights? I bet a tester goes bad really fast in the light and heat. And I mean you, Sephora!
Yes! Yes! Wouldn't most women appreciate honesty more than dishonest flattery? We truly want to know whether something looks good or not! If someone tells us “no” when something really does look bad, then we begin to trust them and their opinion. Same for perfume SAs. I think for the most part that perfume SAs have little to no knowledge of the perfumes they're selling. I moonlighted as a men's fragrance SA at Filene's for awhile, and spent my off time scouring ozmoz to get educated. What did I know about men's scents? Nothing! Did Filene's have a training program? No. Did the sales reps train SAs on new scents? No. Even the sprayers who were hired by the perfume companies didn't really know much about the perfumes they were spraying. Too bad. There's so much to learn and so much to appreciate about scent!!! I know that now, but then, I had no idea…
Hey, I like Cuir! But that's o.k. You can hate it if you want (aren't I magnanimous?).
Sad to say, but every re-release of Lancome's classics, just does something terrible with my body chemistry. I can only wear Magie Noire.
Magie Noire is a good one, in any case. And there's plenty of other perfume out there.
It's great that you took so much time to learn about the fragrances! I know your customers must have really appreciated it.
I own all the fragrances in La Collection; matter of fact I owned all of them before they became said “Collection”. I am not 80 +, only 40, and I adore all of them, with the exception of Peut-être, which I feel is not the same type of quality as the others. I feel they are classic perfumery at it's best.
I'm jealous that you have them all! I'd love a bottle of Sikkim, especially.
It may be boring to female fragrance afficionados, but from car wash attendants to Harvard grad lawyers, MEN LOVE IT! Funny, Women respond to Iris Poudre on me, but the boys go nuts for Peut-Etre.
Hey, that’s good info! Thanks for the research.